Living Will ... A Necessity

Kaiser Sigma · Apr 21, 2005

Narrrf said:
How very...arrogant...of you.

We all find different truths in life. The part you "bolded" is a part of the truth I've found.

Narrrf said:
Careful Boltzmann. This reeks of Terri Schiavo, and you probably don't want another excuse to run away.

Uhuh... Boltzmann have me on his ignore list. He can't reply to me know

KillerShots · Apr 21, 2005

Having a living will is all good and well, but here in the States it doesn't seem to mean much... maybe it does elsewhere.

Example: Shortly after Terri's death, there was another case where an old woman had a living will - she wanted to live. She was terminally ill, but still responsive. She couldn't talk, and she didn't have the strength to write. Her grand daughter was her guardian at the time, and she decided she wanted to pull the feeding tube (sound familiar?). It went through the courts, and apparently the grand daughter was able to override the living will and have the tube pulled. I left the country shortly after it was pulled and could not follow it further. I don't know how it ended, but that's how it began. By the time I returned, it was no longer big news.

What is the point if it can be overturned by someone else?

Grv · Apr 21, 2005

Good to have you back, Boltzmann. I hadn't realized you were. Unfortunately, I've been so busy (+ purposely stayed away from here) that you'll get one or two of your answers only after this weekend (I'm not through Blank Slate yet).

For a Living Will, this "model" seems to contain an awful lot of insults and notes entirely irrelevant to the intended readers and the purpose of the standard Living Will. What's been poured in is too emotional for my taste, and I could barely stomach it when reading this.

エッリー said:
And why are you assuming that there is an after life? I wasn't hinting at that at all. I was just wondering why the hell do people pre-assume many things about death whether they are atheists , theists , or whats not when they don't know.

?

Peace == silence, or rest. A conscious soul is a restless soul. Atheists believe there is nothing to be conscious of after life*. You know what the term unconscious implies.. right? If there is nothing to endure, how can there not be peace? Thus, when one hints a possibility of no peace, one hints consciousness, which logically ends up in being a hint for afterlife.

*Not to be confused with the single noun 'afterlife'

Eface said:
Maybe i got angry because i always hate it when people think lightly of this subject.

Then be sure to ignore me.

Eface said:
I guess everybody who gets over suicidal thoughts and/or tendencies will gain something in the end. Something normal people will never find.

After all that you've said, this is quite bold (excuse the pun). The obvious rhetorical question surfaces: How would you know?

Kaiser Sigma said:
We all find different truths in life.

".. and then little Johnny found out only one can be per issue."

That night, fictional Johnny jumped from a 14 story building. Whether he did that because he couldn't take his last discovery, or because he was trying to prove it wrong, I don't know.

He's dead, by the way.

KillerShots said:
What is the point if it can be overturned by someone else?

It doesn't hurt to have one, anyway, seeing how these situations occur differently on seperate places. Who knows where you'll have yours read. Having none would guarantee uncertainty, whereas having one would lift that guarantee at the very least. Quite frankly, in comparison, no-one can benefit from the first. Except, perhaps, moral satisfactory for the proud and few. Yet not even they will benefit from a situation where they are majorly lost causes being left alive. There is a freak occasion where such lost causes actually regain full health, ofcourse, but I personally don't feel it's worth taking that chance. To those who do, I say suit yourself, to illustrate the obvious fact that I know to respect different opinions. A precaution.

Eface · Apr 21, 2005

Gaurav said:
fter all that you've said, this is quite bold (excuse the pun). The obvious rhetorical question surfaces: How would you know?

By gaining that thing

There are ways to escape suicide without gaining it, but then again, it's just an escape. see it as another lease on life. To me it feels like that. But it's (luckily) more than that. I gained a lot more with that lease

And still gaining today. And the way it's looking right now, it'll keep me entertained for at least a couple of years.

Damn, i should've becomen suicidal a lot sooner :evil: wait... i already almost killed myself and i wasn't even trying, did prove my theory about myself tho

Kaiser Sigma · Apr 21, 2005

Gaurav said:
That night, fictional Johnny jumped from a 14 story building. Whether he did that because he couldn't take his last discovery, or because he was trying to prove it wrong, I don't know. He's dead, by the way.

So... do you claim to posess the absolute truth for every single issue?
If answer = yes then
share with the rest of us because that will be grand
else
does that means that everything you believe in is false?

Making aside your ridiculous examples which obviously are not what I was talking about truth is something that has more faces than we'd like it to have. The best example is too look at this board when everyone start arguing about religion, suicide, politics, etc.

Grv · Apr 21, 2005

Eface said:
By gaining that thing There are ways to escape suicide without gaining it, but then again, it's just an escape. see it as another lease on life. To me it feels like that. But it's (luckily) more than that. I gained a lot more with that lease And still gaining today. And the way it's looking right now, it'll keep me entertained for at least a couple of years.

Damn, i should've becomen suicidal a lot sooner :evil: wait... i already almost killed myself and i wasn't even trying, did prove my theory about myself tho

The question was rhetorical because the answer is that you don't. You assume "normal" people will never gain that part in life what former-suicidees quite possibly can, yet you've stated yourself to be part of the latter category, thus unknowing of what goes on in people that remain in the first category.

There is more than one way to Rome.

Kaiser Sigma said:
So... do you claim to posess the absolute truth?

Your if-statement is irrelevant, because nowhere did I claim such. The story was there to point out that either you or Narrrf is correct about the issue that concerned him. To know which one requires knowledge I do not posess. It was a note, Sigma. One that holds true as the story that was told goes. That much, I know.

Kaiser Sigma said:
Making aside your ridiculous examples which obviously are not what I was talking about truth is something that has more faces than we'd like it to have. The best example is too look at this board when everyone start arguing about religion, suicide, politics, etc.

Hehe. Yet Narrrf's concern is only moral superficially, where in in essence it is not. For the latter, my note stands. Such is truth.

Cid Highwind · Apr 21, 2005

Eface said:
You don't happen to be from the netherlands right? :lol:

I expected this comment from someone, but not from you

Yeah I'm dutch, but more important on this subject, I have thought about it and have my own opinion, regardless of what country I come from

Though I'm not the kind of person to give up on someone or someone's life easily. But I prefer to have the option of giving up, instead of having the complete world argue about wether I should be kept alive while I'm suffering or that I should just let it all go.
To me having the option doesn't mean you have to make use of it.

About the resting in peace and an afterlife: I'll just wait and see what comes after this life, there's still a lot of things to do here, all the time I'm wondering about an afterlife can be used in a better way (and perhaps in a way to please the one who guards the gate to a positive afterlife

)

Kaiser Sigma · Apr 21, 2005

Gaurav said:
Hehe. Yet Narrrf's concern is only moral superficially, where in in essence it is not. For the latter, my note stands. Such is truth.

No, such is your truth.

Mr. Killjoy · Apr 21, 2005

Boltz -> Print a copy for me

>> Uhuh... Boltzmann have me on his ignore list. He can't reply to me know

Huh? why?

Boltzmann · Apr 21, 2005

エッリー said:
And why are you assuming that there is an after life? I wasn't hinting at that at all. I was just wondering why the hell do people pre-assume many things about death whether they are atheists , theists , or whats not when they don't know.

Because if you don't think that there's an afterlife, you're not concerned about the well-being of the dead. So, if you're suffering in life, there'll be no suffering after death, since there'll be no conscience the feel the pain.

And given that no atheists believe in an afterlife, your question makes no sense in regards to them.

Eface said:
As someone who has thought about suicide, i am always shocked about how people think about it, about their ignorance and about their dumb arrogance. Those people deserve a painfull death over and over again. Maybe then they'll understand what they wish upon others.

I've thought about it, and even attempted it once (though no one in real life knows about this, except for my GF).

Suicidal thoughts surely helped me to grow up. It made me see new possibilities in life.

Narrrf said:
Careful Boltzmann. This reeks of Terri Schiavo, and you probably don't want another excuse to run away.

1. I didn't run away. The thread got closed.

2. I don't care about your religious opinions. I've no respect for you, so I won't bother replying to your posts. In fact, I'll add you to my ignore list, so I'll save my eyes the direct insults contained in your posts (and the total lack of content).

3. Yes, this post is insulting, and you deserve it. It won't happen anymore, though, since I'm putting you in my ignore list.

Gaurav said:
Good to have you back, Boltzmann. I hadn't realized you were. Unfortunately, I've been so busy (+ purposely stayed away from here) that you'll get one or two of your answers only after this weekend (I'm not through Blank Slate yet).

Yep, I couldn't stay away for long. As I told Proto earlier, this place kinda grows on you.

Anyway, I created some personal policies, so I can still have fun posting

My first measure was ignoring Kaiser Sigma after he attempted to draw me in a flame war about science. My second is ignoring Narrrf, since he's full of insults towards me.

This way I can have fun and not fill the boards with endless discussion without real content.

Gaurav said:
For a Living Will, this "model" seems to contain an awful lot of insults and notes entirely irrelevant to the intended readers and the purpose of the standard Living Will. What's been poured in is too emotional for my taste, and I could barely stomach it when reading this.

Well, it was actually meant to be this way. It's not a real Living Will model, but a sarcastic comment on the whole Terri Schiavo brouhaha.

Reading it this way (and not as serious document), made it quite entertaining to me, because I share many of the feelings spoused by the author.

Gaurav said:
".. and then little Johnny found out only one can be per issue."

That night, fictional Johnny jumped from a 14 story building. Whether he did that because he couldn't take his last discovery, or because he was trying to prove it wrong, I don't know. He's dead, by the way.

:lol: It's so easy to disprove relativism. I wonder how radical post-modernism (Jacques Derrida-style; Foucalt made some interesting points) still exists.

There's only one truth. Most of the time we'll have only an approximation to it (that's why we refine our theories, and send them away once they contradict the data), but surely there's an underlying reality common to us all.

I hate social constructivism :lol:

Mr. Killjoy said:
Boltz -> Print a copy for me

>> Uhuh... Boltzmann have me on his ignore list. He can't reply to me know

Huh? why?

Just fill your name and you're done

As for your second question, read what I wrote to Gaurav.

The particular incident that I mentioned happened here: http://www.ngemu.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61124&page=6&pp=20

Kaiser Sigma · Apr 22, 2005

Boltzmann said:
My first measure was ignoring Kaiser Sigma after he attempted to draw me in a flame war about science. My second is ignoring Narrrf, since he's full of insults towards me.

Mmm... this brings some interesting posibilities... wonder if I can pull the same stunt I pulled with Proto? :lol:

You people are so predictable

D.D. · Apr 22, 2005

till this day i didnt even know there was a ignore list thingy.

Kaiser Sigma · Apr 22, 2005

That's because you are too nice as to want to have someone ignored...

Boltzmann · Apr 22, 2005

D.D. said:
till this day i didnt even know there was a ignore list thingy.

Believe me, it's damn useful if you are like me and can't restrain yourself.

Fortunately, I don't think it has to be used too often here. I can only think of a third person who could be added to my own ignore list.

Mr. Killjoy · Apr 22, 2005

>> And given that no atheists believe in an afterlife, your question makes no sense in regards to them.

Wrong, you can believe in an afterlife even as an atheist... then it all depends on what's afterlife for you. I think there COULD be another life after this one, similar life, in a body and all that crap... but I don't believe in Hell nor Paradise (they're ok in fictions though).
And I say 'COULD', I'm not sure of anything, I just hope there's nothing after

EDIT: Nice Ignore feature huh ^^

Narrrf · Apr 22, 2005

Boltzmann said:
1. I didn't run away. The thread got closed.

No, you ran away.
http://www.ngemu.com/forums/showpost.php?p=839818&postcount=37

>>The moment some admin warns me because of any of my posts against religion, I'm leaving this place for good.

:thumb: Remember that? Oh right, you can't see me. Hehehaha~

But what about your precious feelings? What about your God given- *ahem - scientifically proven, human rights? Oh, no, someone doesnt' agree with you~ :lol:

2. I don't care about your religious opinions. I've no respect for you, so I won't bother replying to your posts. In fact, I'll add you to my ignore list, so I'll save my eyes the direct insults contained in your posts (and the total lack of content).

Ahh! Whatever will become of me?

3. Yes, this post is insulting, and you deserve it. It won't happen anymore, though, since I'm putting you in my ignore list.

Hahaha. Ooh you're putting me on your ignore list. Ooh, you're not going to respond to anything I say. Ooh, I'm soooo offended. Oh no, what will I do with my life now that you're not in it? "Oh, look at me! I'm making people happy! I'm the Magical Man from Happy-Land, in a gumdrop house on Lollipop Lane!" Bwahaha! :rotflmao:

"Oh, by the way, I was being sarcastic."

High five Kaiser Sigma! Oh yeah~ What did you call him again? Drama-whore? :lol:

Kaiser Sigma said:
Mmm... this brings some interesting posibilities... wonder if I can pull the same stunt I pulled with Proto? :lol:

Nah, Proto's actually a pretty decent guy with some misguided ideas. He's not beyond rehabilitation unlike the other fellow here.

D.D. · Apr 22, 2005

O_O

why did u just knowingly write a response to someone who wont even read what u wrote him

(and why am i always off topic? i dunno)

Narrrf · Apr 22, 2005

D.D. said:
O_O

why did u just knowingly write a response to someone who wont even read what u wrote him

(and why am i always off topic? i dunno)

Because of the sheer irony involved in such an endevour. I still can't stop laughing. :rotflmao:

I don't know what's funnier: the reverse psychology or him proving what he's spoken out against all along, that is ignorance is bliss ain't it?

Kaiser Sigma · Apr 22, 2005

D.D. said:
why did u just knowingly write a response to someone who wont even read what u wrote him

It is because the person can't read it that you write... it serves to entertain some thoughts...

D.D. · Apr 22, 2005

um. XD okay then

Living Will ... A Necessity

Kaiser Sigma

KillerShots

Grv

Eface

Kaiser Sigma

Grv

Cid Highwind

Kaiser Sigma

Mr. Killjoy

Boltzmann

Kaiser Sigma

D.D.

Kaiser Sigma

Boltzmann

Mr. Killjoy

Narrrf

D.D.

Narrrf

Kaiser Sigma

D.D.

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