[Hannibal]

Is Most-Certainly Not 42. I been thinking (I dont usually do or like to) but as I was stuck in a traffic jam it came to my mind the question that I suppose arises to everyone sometime during their lives what am I doing here? whats the purpose of being here? I never felt attracted to religion. They have been countless of religions in the history of mankind all of them different and every single one claimed or claims to have the truth and declares all others false. It seems that religions to me are created by men each shape by their experiences. Even more does God exist? I mean would a perfect being create this imperfec world? An all powerful God could have seen the future maybe he could have fix the problem before it started and he being perfect in all matters could have not created an imperfect being to begin with. Even more why would an almighty God create us? I mean he does not need us since He is perfect and complete in all ways. But them if there is no God are we just the result of randomness with no meaning at all. All around us we see the beauty and complexity of nature could this just be the result of chance and change. Thats depressing we are just some highly evolve beings with the only purpose to reproduce. All the people who do evil (if there is since if there is no God maybe everything is relative) or harm others would not get justice. To me it seems very depressing if there is no God we only have seveny years to live a life full of pain agony injustices etc. and then we died becoming nothing as we turn into dirt. Is there really an answer to the meaning of life the universe and everything?

 

[Boltzmann]

No matter what you think, the answer is 6

But seriously, you don’t need god or religion to give you meaning or purpose. The beautiful part of being human is that we can create meaning for ourselves and our lives (as Dale Carrico once put it, “every man is a poem”).

And even though there’re no absolute, cosmically imposed, “right” and “wrong”, the distinction between the two matters a lot in our lives. Killing your neighbor is “wrong”, regardless of the ontological status of god (if only for game theoretical reasons.

And evolution is not mere chance. Evolution is contingent by nature, but it’s not based on pure chance. Small adaptations accumulate following rules that are anything but random. See for instance George C.Williams masterpiece Adaptation and Natural Selection .

And we, as human beings can get past our own selfish genes. That’s why we should strive to be humane, instead of only human. Gandhi and Hitler were humans, but only Gandhi was humane.

And do you know why you’re so worried about justice? That’s because of your genes. Social animals (like all primates) have deep-seated instincts for retribution and fair treatment (they evolve naturally in any Evolutionary Stable Strategies [EES]). Don’t worry so much about an abstract “justice” (which usually means punishing others), but think about preventing crime from happening in the first place.

Of course, all of this is easier said than done, but where would be the fun if it were easy?

BTW, check out the FAQ About the Meaning of Life

 

[Xymet]

Funny Topic, but did expect it to come around in a Forum. All the more advanced Religions believe that the First Man did not evolve and that he was made by God (whatever name, that may be (but to me Allah)). In Christianity, the christian deep believers have lost interest in world. In Jewish religion, jews believe that Jews are the masters and non-jews are slaves,look at Communism, and look at any other religion, some flaws. But in Islam - It encourages both World and Hereafter life, Angels and Men and Genies (Jinns), Community and Yourself. All based on one reality, one God, who made all his beings to pray to him. Thats your destiny. In the holy verses, it says "From the earth you come, to the earth you go, and to earth you become and unto me you return".

Imagine yourself, and another two people as shareholders of a company. Think of a situation when all of you are against each other. What would happen to the company? it would break up and fall. Such is life, had there been more than one God, life on earth would be impossible. In a holy verse in Quran, Allah relates "Had there been more than one God, everything between the throne of god in the seventh sky to the ground would have been destroyed" this relates that he is one and only. The all mightyfull.

Think of a computer, the creator of the computer knows that if we do something against the userguide, such and such a problem would occur. But if we ignore the userguide and the creators warnings we would be in trouble. God is so. He knows all, and he has send the messenger, to instruct you of what is good and bad. If you do not heed it. You would be in trouble.

Lest, forget all that. Your purpose in life would be to pray to the lord who created you. Life itself is the prayer. so utilise it, while it is with you and live a sin-free life.

And judgement day comes. The day comes as warned by the first man ADAM and the first woman EVE, the day would come as Ibrahim promised, the day would come as Solomon, David and Noah has said, and also the Day would come as Mohammed (s.a.w) has said. The day no one shall be spared. Everyone shall get their just deserts for their actions. Every sinner, punished, all justice shall be served. and the holy verse says "and the evildooers will say - Oh! Allah, had you given us another lifetime, we would have lived better lives", so be not among evil and unbeleivers

 

[Boltzmann]

Companies have no problem with several partners (which are the "Creators"), as long as the partners think about the well-being of the company. So, if there were two loving gods, who loved the world equally, there would be peace as well

Anyway, your post doesn't apply to me. I don't pray, because I don't believe in prayer. I don't accept praying as a purpose for life.

That's why I maintain that each person should create their own purpose and meaning, instead of looking elsewhere (e.g. holy books) for it.

At least this is what I do as an atheist

BTW, it was a good gratuitous bashing on the Christians and Jews, Otrivin

 

[xRock]

Otrivin is pouncing on the oppurtunity to talk about..... religion. Well hehe think bout this

Even more does God exist? I mean would a perfect being create this imperfec world? An all powerful God could have seen the future maybe he could have fix the problem before it started and he being perfect in all matters could have not created an imperfect being to begin with.

 

[Hannibal]

I believe that today the religion that most people observe results from the relegion that their parents observe and because that is the major determinent in the religion that a person practices that religion is not necessarily thruth. Christian parents teach their offspring christianity Muslim parents teach their offspring islam and so on. If an a person instead of being born to an American christian he would had born to an Iranian muslim he would not be a christian but a muslim. I have other question regarding the three major monotheist religions. Since we descend from the same two persons shouldnt we all be similar. I mean shouldnt there be only one race? Secondly if there was only two persons at the beginning does that mean that the offspring of Adam and Eve had sex with each other or they had sex with there parents? How did Noah fit all those animals into his ship? I mean two of every animal from the world that would be millions of animals. sorry if I asked many questions but I have limited knowledge

I dont think technology can resolve everything. It can help but technology also can cause problems. The problems of the world result from people with or without advance science and technology .I am pretty sure the first artificially intelligent robot will be a soldier design to kill eventually every one would get artificially intelligent robots and they would be design to make war.

 

[D.D.]

for the race question, i believe (very big chance im wrong) the bible states that we were all jews until we got separated by God at the tower of babel .

 

[Dark Watcher]

Usually these topics go sour..but we will allow it for now. Pleas ekeep it civil, and keep in mind that when you push your own beliefs..you offend the beliefs of others.
It is difficult to carry such a topic without stepping on someone elses toes because it is human nature to want to be right and prove someone else wrong...but no person has all the answers...Even with Boltz amazing scientific and theological references...none hold definite answers..only theories that sound feasible.

about religion....indeed it is man made. They are all the individual interpretations of a common faith. The belief in a great creator or God. Faith and belief is a beautiful thing, but the varied interpretations have done nothing but seperate us as humans...but seperations tends to be what humans do racially, religiously, politically...we all seem to wind up lumped into some sort or other.

Take a look at the largest of faiths.. Christianity, Faiths of Islam, and the Jewish faith....All believe in a single God....All trace back to the same scriptures! However somewhere down the line the interpretations varied..The faiths are identical before the time of Christ..It is then that they go astray....

So rather then bashing religion, questioning the faiths of others, or the like....Know that we are all pretty much practicing the same faith and praying to the same God...we just do it differently.

And to those who don't...We can respect your theories, and follow how the universe may have been created, but until you can answer the questions of WHY or WHO..the the HOW of creation will remain a mystery....as will the answer to Life and the Universe...the very same questions this topic addresses.

So may God bless you all..and for you athiests out there...May your life be long and fulfilling

 

[Raziel]

You don't need god or anything, your purpose in life should be to make it (your life) as enjoyable as possible, though some feel like dedicating their lives to leaving a mark in history

 

[Boltzmann]

And to those who don't...We can respect your theories, and follow how the universe may have been created, but until you can answer the questions of WHY or WHO..the the HOW of creation will remain a mystery....

There's no "why" or "who" as far as science goes. Assuming that there's a "who" is the same as assuming that there's a deity of some kind, and I've no need for any deities. And "why" is a philosophical question, not a scientific one. Science does not concern itself with "why", but only with "how".

That's why I didn't even bring science into my post. I don't derive my values from science; I only use science to help me make choices. You cannot derive (at least not directly) ought from is

I believe that today the religion that most people observe results from the relegion that their parents observe and because that is the major determinent in the religion that a person practices that religion is not necessarily thruth. Christian parents teach their offspring christianity Muslim parents teach their offspring islam and so on. If an a person instead of being born to an American christian he would had born to an Iranian muslim he would not be a christian but a muslim. I have other question regarding the three major monotheist religions. Since we descend from the same two persons shouldnt we all be similar. I mean shouldnt there be only one race? Secondly if there was only two persons at the beginning does that mean that the offspring of Adam and Eve had sex with each other or they had sex with there parents? How did Noah fit all those animals into his ship? I mean two of every animal from the world that would be millions of animals. sorry if I asked many questions but I have limited knowledge

If you accept my advice, for whatever it's worth, don't begin questioning religion in this thread. You'll get it locked as soon as some guys pop up claiming that they're being offended.

And as I've said, you don't have to worry about religion if you don't want to

I dont think technology can resolve everything. It can help but technology also can cause problems. The problems of the world result from people with or without advance science and technology .I am pretty sure the first artificially intelligent robot will be a soldier design to kill eventually every one would get artificially intelligent robots and they would be design to make war.

True AI will probably arrive before T2-style robots.

And I don't fear a war waged by machines as much as I fear the massive unemployment and increasingly uneven income distributions that will result from cheap machine labour. The rich will become filthy rich, and the poor will be unemployed. That's what will happen if we let things go on as wished by the free markets zealots. See Robotic Nation Evidence .

There's a better solution, of course, and it involved distributing the income generated by the robots. Technology can create a better world for us all, but we must steer it in the right way

 

[Xymet]

This place is in appropriate to talk about religion. Guys, theres a whole bunch of websites about religion. and there are many learned scholars that you can talk to regarding this matter. Try searching through them guys.... As someone just said, you might offend somebody and thats not what we all want is it. We all have a commonity in our selves. Just let us enjoy the time that we have ..... together.....

 

[Proto]

The theist that posted above me is offending me. He is pushing his beliefs down on me. Therefore God doesn't exist.

And I don't fear a war waged by machines as much as I fear the massive unemployment and increasingly uneven income distributions that will result from cheap machine labour. The rich will become filthy rich, and the poor will be unemployed. That's what will happen if we let things go on as wished by the free markets zealots. See Robotic Nation Evidence .

There's a better solution, of course, and it involved distributing the income generated by the robots. Technology can create a better world for us all, but we must steer it in the right way

The problem with the distributed income solution is that it would have us living as parasites. And I don't think it'd help if we all dedicated ourselves to more intellectual work, because true AI will eventually get better than us at it, hence rendering us useless :nod:

 

[Grv]

Is there really an answer to the meaning of life the universe and everything?

I never understood why the question needs to be asked in the first place. Is that what we know of the universe not established to be chaotic and unorganized? I would beg to question why our origin would be any different.

Also, the only thing that keeps standing in the living world (not counting posessions) from deceased people is the knowledge and genes they have passed on. If one desperately requires to have some meaning beyond one's own power, then there's the answer they seek: we are consumption to our own progress; we live to serve humanity, ourselves. The question ends up in a circle one cannot answer without anything self-designated. It ends up being a personal thing. Hence, the only purpose or meaning I consider worthy of believing in is the one I assign to myself.

And we, as human beings can get past our own selfish genes. That’s why we should strive to be humane, instead of only human.

An expectation I've been made to hate with all my heart. Don't get me wrong, I love benelovence, kindness and all good that comes from it, but the expectations that have come with this matter are an open wound people would dare prevent me from licking. The mere expectation is a belief being forced onto society by society of which I don't want any part of, for my (our) nature is believed to be monstrous because of it.

Imagine yourself, and another two people as shareholders of a company. Think of a situation when all of you are against each other. What would happen to the company? it would break up and fall. Such is life, had there been more than one God, life on earth would be impossible. In a holy verse in Quran, Allah relates "Had there been more than one God, everything between the throne of god in the seventh sky to the ground would have been destroyed" this relates that he is one and only. The all mightyfull.

I can think of at least two reasons why this is inherently flawed, aswell as some very intriguing questions that result from this. I would have loved to express them were it not for the intolerance often exclaimed here when I'll bring up mere considerations different from popular belief. ;p *sigh*

so be not among evil and unbeleivers

Judgement day would judge each and everyone regardless of chosen belief, equally. Don't try to sneak your personal bias in the teachings you draw from; it's considered sacrilegious.

Only those who are not afraid to die are fit to live.

Then surely, self-preservation would kill us all.

when you push your own beliefs..you offend the beliefs of others.

Your words are respectful in appearance, yet..

And to those who don't...We can respect your theories, and follow how the universe may have been created, but until you can answer the questions of WHY or WHO..the the HOW of creation will remain a mystery....as will the answer to Life and the Universe...the very same questions this topic addresses.

.. the fundamental questions you would like us of atheistic belief to pursue find their roots in your beliefs, and are conflicting with ours. Not that we would be offended or anything... except Proto perhaps.

 

[Boltzmann]

An expectation I've been made to hate with all my heart. Don't get me wrong, I love benelovence, kindness and all good that comes from it, but the expectations that have come with this matter are an open wound people would dare prevent me from licking. The mere expectation is a belief being forced onto society by society of which I don't want any part of, for my (our) nature is believed to be monstrous because of it.

Society doesn’t truly expect us to rise above our base natures. At best they worship a faux altruism/benevolence, that are really awful.

But there’s a lot in human nature that I don’t like, and I’d like to see changed (if only in myself). But my whole philosophy is based on personal choice, and not what I expect others to do.

 

[Grv]

But my whole philosophy is based on personal choice, and not what I expect others to do.

The way you worded it reminds me of altruistic people in my past who did, so I expressed my thoughts on it.

Holland is a very benevolent country. The common man here expects you to be as benevolent.

 

[Dark Watcher]

Your words are respectful in appearance, yet..
.. the fundamental questions you would like us of atheistic belief to pursue find their roots in your beliefs, and are conflicting with ours. Not that we would be offended or anything... except Proto perhaps.

Actually...If your reading our words while being defensive..then yes you would get that interpretation..

However..what we meant to demonstrate is how neither the religious or the athiests have all the answers....so rather then picking apart each others views...we should just respect them :thumb:

We would never expect Proto or Boltz to become God believers. We know their positions..so we have no intentions of picking apart there views or pushing our own agenda.

So where does that leave us....DW is a God believer...and They are not....Does that effect our ability to carry a topic with them? Not really...So long as it isn't a religious debate :heh:

With that said....This topic is quickly becoming pointless..........

 

[Hannibal]

With that said....This topic is quickly becoming pointless..........

Many people actually believe that the whole universe is pointless. In fact they believe than nothing is woth anything. I asked a nihilist if everything is worth nothing why he did not just die since it wouldnt matter. He responded that that it did not matter if he live either. So it does not matter either way because no matter what we do we are nothing so living or dying is the same so it does not matter.

 

[Boltzmann]

The way you worded it reminds me of altruistic people in my past who did, so I expressed my thoughts on it.

Holland is a very benevolent country. The common man here expects you to be as benevolent.

Now that I read again what I've written, it certainly sounded like that.

So it does not matter either way because no matter what we do we are nothing so living or dying is the same so it does not matter.

It matters to me whether I live or die, even if it doesn't matter to anyone else. Living or dying are not the same thing to me (even though I'm not too worried about death).

Try to learn what matters to you, instead of what matters to others.

 

[ChankastRules]

First i'm glad none have said final fantasy in this post yet... it appears to be the answer to everything for some people here

Secondly, the PS6 is going to be able to store our complete structure including genes and neurons and what not, and recreate us at a younger age with a new body, but exactly the same memories ( that is if we want them ), so we better try to survive until it happesns!

Okay, so I'm being a little sarcastic but the topic kind of called for it

 

[Dark Watcher]

Final Fantasy!