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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
(first post, hi all)

No need to worry, I'm not some DBZ obsessed noobler whos come to annoy you to hell.
(OMG y wonet my gaimez plaey wtf doods, Whuts a warez and were can i dl it plzkthx, screennames like L1nk1np4rkfan420 etc... EUGH)
I've been emulating since the (golden) days of UltraHLE. Zelda 64 on Pentium 3/Voodoo 3 w/glide, man that was good stuff.

Anyway, just wondering if SSE3 or X86-64 support would help if they were ever implemented say in a later version? With nearly every CPU being produced now having these features enabled, perhaps supporting these technologies might take away a bit of the 'sting' as far as high hardware requirements. Maybe SSE3 wouldn't have that much of an impact, but I would think that X86-64 is a bit more suited to emulating the 128bit emotion engine, than plain old IA32.

Looking forward to future releases.
 

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Esoteric930 said:
(first post, hi all)
Welcome!

No need to worry, I'm not some DBZ obsessed noobler whos come to annoy you to hell.
(OMG y wonet my gaimez plaey wtf doods, Whuts a warez and were can i dl it plzkthx, screennames like L1nk1np4rkfan420 etc... EUGH)
I've been emulating since the (golden) days of UltraHLE. Zelda 64 on Pentium 3/Voodoo 3 w/glide, man that was good stuff.
That is more the bronze age of emulation. The golden age was more like 10-20 years ago... :)

Anyway, just wondering if SSE3 or X86-64 support would help if they were ever implemented say in a later version? With nearly every CPU being produced now having these features enabled, perhaps supporting these technologies might take away a bit of the 'sting' as far as high hardware requirements. Maybe SSE3 wouldn't have that much of an impact, but I would think that X86-64 is a bit more suited to emulating the 128bit emotion engine, than plain old IA32.

Looking forward to future releases.
This has already been discussed. It is on the list of things to do. But that is rather far down at the moment. and In the next 2 years better options will likely be available.
 

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i imagine they will be implemented when the processors are more common amongst users, at the moment only about 25% of users have SSE2 and that has only recently been introduced into PCSX2, so at the moment its still early days.

Also to use x86-64 you have to be running a 64bit operating system, of which only a handful of people are using currently, so again, very early days for using that.
 

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This may sound a little nooby but, I never understood why an application would not be able use 64-bit instructions in a 32-bit OS if the processor has 64-bit extensions, at least for functions that don't require things like DirectX, OpenGL or any other Windows-specific libraries. I mean couldn't the application just have a custom Statically Linked 'processor driver' it could use to access the 64-bit registers in the CPU(I don't know wether this would be faster or slower though). The reason I ask this is because I can already boot up 64-bit linux on my machine and run 32-bit apps and 64-bit apps side by side, so I know the hardware at least is capable of doing it.

Note: I'm talking about on AMD64 systems that have separate 64-bit registers(I have heard that Intel 64-bit processors use the same registers for 64 and 32 bit operations).

Disclaimer: It is highly unlikely that I know what I am talking about in these regards.
 

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because the processor has drivers in windows, if you used an x86-64 command in a 32bit OS, you are using 64bits instructions obviously and the kernel throws a wobbly and really doesnt like it.

infact you try running a 64bit compiled program in XP-32, itll simply say "not a valid win32 application"
 

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BCM124 said:
So, its entirely a windows problem basically(how foolish of me to have guessed that, since linux could do it, windows could too :nono: ).
I'm quite sure that 64-bit linux programs also need a 64-bit linux... It's just the way the 64-bit support is done on the processor.
 

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slofreak said:
guys i think none of the members care about your rules i think you should edit it and maybe put a 100 arial lol
we tried that with GTA San Andreas, we still had people asking :p
 

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If I may ask another question concerning this topic: Would SSE3 going to be very useful in PS2 emulation, meaning would the performance increase significantly compared to SSE2 (let's say with over 3-5%)? And is such a thing difficult to implement?
 

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lightchris said:
If I may ask another question concerning this topic: Would SSE3 going to be very useful in PS2 emulation, meaning would the performance increase significantly compared to SSE2 (let's say with over 3-5%)? And is such a thing difficult to implement?
it would take time to implement and the performance boost would be minimal i think
 

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A little off-topic but ... i was wondering. If the support for 32 or 64 Bit is handled by some sort of "driver" in windows and it's just about new instructions shouldn't it be relatively easy to make a patch or service pack that upgrades a regular windows to handle a 64Bit CPU to its fullest and let the 64Bit apps run? Last time i checked 64Bit win cost a hefty sum more than the old one, given it's only some new instructions to be handled that sounds rather unfair. Not that it would be surprising, knowing Micro$oft...



PS: I dont have the slightest about programming an stuff. It's just the impression i got from the SSE2 threas, etc.

EDIT: Ok, my fault. Just checked again and Win64 is prized just as the normal one. Still it would be nice to give windows owners the option to upgrade their old one instead of spending a 100 or more bucks for a new OS. Next thing you know we'll have to buy new OS's for our GFX cards. :/
 

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The way cpu is handled at kernel level

When the operaing systems kernel initializes the cpu eg installing GDT, IDT, enable pmode etc... , now if you are still running in 32-bit legacy protected mode any 64-bit instructions to the cpu would cause a proteciton fault, where as on the 64-bit os where long mode/64-bit compatibility mode(what winxp 64 runs in) was initialized thus enabling the full features of the cpu such as extended registers, and functions.

Things like MMX, 3DNow!, SSE, SSE2 are independant of this just to note that.

Thats my 2 cents worth.
 

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InnarX
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But according to what I know/heard, this really won't make SUCH an important difference. I believe there have been previous posts that talked about this, and from what I remember, 64-bit architecture won't make a significant difference.

But, I guess I could be wrong. :D

r2rX :p
 

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shouldn't it be relatively easy to make a patch or service pack that upgrades a regular windows to handle a 64Bit CPU to its fullest and let the 64Bit apps run?
Like rup1033 said it´s not that easy. The OS would have to double every instruction
in bytelength which brings some problems like over/underflow checks and things
like this. This would cost a lot of performance because if such an emulation would
be done ALL instructions would have to be handled like this. It´s much more complicated doubling instruction sizes than cut off the half of it ;)

And yes ready2rumbelX, I testet some applications and most times the advantage
of 64bit is not so huge. OK FarCry64 looks nice and runs fine but I think they
could have realized the same with 32bit.
Most of my tested appz run 1-11% better where the avg was around 4% performance
increase which is not really that noticeable with some appz.
 

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No increase with 64bit yet.

Hi guys, sorry to bring back a 14 day old post but thought i would say something about the 64bit part, i have WinXP 64Bit Pro and when running Pcsx2 their was no improvement of speed it was the same as when i ran 0.8 on the 32bit verison of XP pro with the same computer, and ofcourse why should their be any improvment even if its in a 64bit OS when the application is 32bit, i got to say though i was half expecting it to be worse cuz since its a 32bit program you half to emulate the 32bit programs in the 64bit windows with Microsofts WoW64 emulator. And even if Pcsx2 gets compiled into a 64bit version we'd probably see very little increase of proformance not so much on the end of the dev team making it but more so as the support for 64bit drivers is still quit low and most of them in beta stages in the first place. I used programs that have had full 64bit support versions made , example Virtualdub 64bit and in most case all i saw was a few seconds to perhaps 1 min less time on encoding video files some cases it was the exact same speed compared to 32bit one, even if pcsx2 happened to pull a 100% 64bit compatible version out of their asses, there'd still be a minimal increase in proformance because of the need for better drivers from nvidia and other Mobo companys for their chipset drivers + video card drivers (yes i know ATi and nvidia have video drivers that arn't betas anymore, but they still need improvement for better useage of 64bit) and other drivers for much other things. Anyways point is untill 64bit is utilized better with the hardware in our PCs your just not gonna see huge increases of proformance from the softwares made in 64bit.

I'd dout you guys would make this a sticky but perhaps post info like i've said into the FAQ (unless already their) so 64bit asking wont keep happening, but you never know, you said no GTA San A in big letters but people still kept asking lol.
 

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DBZ_GOD said:
Hi guys, sorry to bring back a 14 day old post but thought i would say something about the 64bit part, i have WinXP 64Bit Pro and when running Pcsx2 their was no improvement of speed it was the same as when i ran 0.8 on the 32bit verison of XP pro with the same computer, and ofcourse why should their be any improvment even if its in a 64bit OS when the application is 32bit, i got to say though i was half expecting it to be worse cuz since its a 32bit program you half to emulate the 32bit programs in the 64bit windows with Microsofts WoW64 emulator. And even if Pcsx2 gets compiled into a 64bit version we'd probably see very little increase of proformance not so much on the end of the dev team making it but more so as the support for 64bit drivers is still quit low and most of them in beta stages in the first place. I used programs that have had full 64bit support versions made , example Virtualdub 64bit and in most case all i saw was a few seconds to perhaps 1 min less time on encoding video files some cases it was the exact same speed compared to 32bit one, even if pcsx2 happened to pull a 100% 64bit compatible version out of their asses, there'd still be a minimal increase in proformance because of the need for better drivers from nvidia and other Mobo companys for their chipset drivers + video card drivers (yes i know ATi and nvidia have video drivers that arn't betas anymore, but they still need improvement for better useage of 64bit) and other drivers for much other things. Anyways point is untill 64bit is utilized better with the hardware in our PCs your just not gonna see huge increases of proformance from the softwares made in 64bit.

I'd dout you guys would make this a sticky but perhaps post info like i've said into the FAQ (unless already their) so 64bit asking wont keep happening, but you never know, you said no GTA San A in big letters but people still kept asking lol.
there is no improvement in hte 64-bit environment coz they are still trying to make it workable under the 32-bit one. After that comes the reverse playability with PSX games. maybe in 3 or so years they will make it 64-bit usable as well but I think that 32-bit is just optimal anyway.
 
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