Sony and Nintendo's evil war on 2D games. (and gamers)

[Katsuya]

Oh my god... this looks bad...

-data-
Source: Pirate Radio (Game industry underground)

Sony and Nintendo's evil war on 2D games.

During the last few weeks a secret war of sorts has been waged around the world. Days ago Sony corporate documents where released on the internet. These documents contained the SCEI Future Concept Approval Process Guide Lines (F-C-A-P-G-L)

This set of guide lines advises (threatens) game developers on how to move forward with game concepts for the next 5-10 years. If these guide lines are not met, the developer receives suggestions (orders) from the concept approval department. If the developer continues with its planed improvement cycle without significant changes their royalty fees will increase 15%-30% if the developer continues with this undesirable behavior it will receive specialized warnings (tailored harassment) if the developer does not heed the warnings, all publishing rights will be suspended.

Now you may be asking yourself, what are these guide lines?

Besides the normal rules that apply to all companies and developers.

Note: these rules are independent of the ESRB.

(No extreme graphic depictions of violence against children.)
(No extreme graphic depictions of sexual violence)
(No excessive, profanity.)
(No excessive alcohol, tobacco or Drug use)
(No nudity or Excessive sexual themes) [SCEA standard 1995-1999]

So what does this have to do with 2D games? Let me show you a piece of the latest revision of the F-C-A-P-G-L.

____________ SCEI Future Concept Approval Process Guide Lines____________
Rev 19.1 -2004-

Development of two-dimensional games is to be discouraged for the chief home consoles. (PS2, PS3)

This also applies to the handheld market. (PSP)

All games genres under this rule include Action, Adventure, Driving, Role-Playing, Simulation, Sports, and Strategy. (Plus unlisted sub genres)

All games genres not under this rule include Puzzle, and Novel.

Gameplay is irrelevant, as long a graphics standard is kept (3D)

In the case of a non agreement the game will be suggested for the handheld market. (PSP)
-End of first excerpt-

If that hasn't already chilled you to the bone here is some more information.

The designated testing grounds for the new F-C-A-P-G-L are currently the number 2 and 3 game control territories.

The Americas [Sony Computer Entertainment America (SCEA)]
Europe [Sony Computer Entertainment Europe (SCEE)]

If the experiment is successful, a revised and possible stricter version of the policy will hit Asia within the next 3-6 years.

[Sony Computer Entertainment Japan (SCEJ)]

What is also alarming about this is the fact that the seeds of this plan were sewn in 1995.

So how does Nintendo fit in to all of this?

Yes, who would have thought Nintendo and Sony would be collaborating on a new project. Unfortunately it's not a new game system.

It is the birth of an unholy alliance bent on destroying 2D games... or at least imprisoning them in a very small box... the handheld market!

Nintendo has lately adopted the idea of forcing developers to make 2D games only on GBA and now the plot thickens with the addition of the new Duel Screen system.

What game developers has all this effected?

Well, the most notable...


Working Designs (Studio Alex) Lunar 3 on indefinite hold.

Square-Enix (Final Fantasy HiRez) (Final Fantasy tactics 2) (Final Fantasy 3 remake) (Valkyrie Profile 2) (StarOcean chronicles) all 2D tittles on hold (2 concealed)

Note: Sony owns over 20% of Square-Enix.

SNK (King of Fighters Compilation 94-99) (Metal Slug 3) (Fatal Fury anthology) (King of Fighters 2002) (SVC Chaos: SNK vs. Capcom) (Samurai Showdown V) 2 tittles on hold (4 canceled)

Note: Metal Slug 3 is confirmed for release on Xbox.

Nintendo (R&D team) Super Mario World: the legend of Yoshi 1 canceled

Note: The legend of Yoshi is believed to have switch to GBA or Nintendo DS

Konami: (Castlevania: the hunter) (Metal Gear: Lost mission) situation unknown.

Note: its speculated both tittles will go to PSP, GBA or Nintendo DS.

Did any of these games look fun to you? Well too bad Nintendo and Sony killed them, and will continue to do so... if we don't make a stand!

Fight For 2D games!



End second transmission...

-=-=-=-=pIrAtE R@di0-=-==-
-data-

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Last edited by Katsuya; March 5th, 2004 at 12:23..

[RZetlin]

After reading this post I think it's time to post some information on Sony's approval process.

won't reveal my friend's name or company, but suffice to say it's a smaller organization. What he told me about Sony's current "concept approval" process blew my mind. Among other things:

* SCEA now rejects any 2D game out of hand.

* Gameplay does not, in any way, enter into the process, but graphics are all-important. My friend was quite literally told this: a gorgeous game that plays like doggie poo will be approved, and a fantastic game that looks like doggie poo will not be approved.

* My friend's company had almost completely localized the PS2 sequel to a successful PS1 game, thinking its approval was a no-brainer, but SCEA rejected it.

* SCEA is about to publish a new set of concept-approval guidelines to make its idiotic priorities clearer to third-party publishers, because companies are desperately trying to figure out what Sony is thinking.

As if it wasn't already obvious: SCEA doesn't give two plug nickels about hardcore gamers. And unfortunately, the sales charts back up its position. My friend bemoaned the fact that no one, himself included, can figure out how to sell non-sequel, non-tie-in, non-GTA clones on the PS2. The utter failure of Beyond Good and Evil and the underperformance of The Sands of Time have the entire industry freaked out.

I am, as of today, officially a Sony-hater.

-- Z.

Sony may suffer the same fate as the Sega Saturn.

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[cloudvii]

this is stupid , first of all :
1) fighting games : Tekken and Soul series are perfect , but nothing is like 2d fighting , remember the challenge , power , colours , anime style . u can't throw these for just 3d gaming

2) Sqaure-Enix : Square isn't stupid to make remakes of it's old ff games (2d ones) and as we all saw , it made a huge success .

3) SNK : After they overcame bankruptcy , do Nintendo and Sony want to kill SNK now ?


I think we should make a complaint or something , we gamers should do anything to stop this nonsense

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[Razor Blade]

No. Plus I think that is bullcrap. Sony won't reject 2D games or a game just because the graphics dont measure up to a Gran Turismo Title. Plain crap. Sony won't be having the same fate as Sega Saturn.

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Last edited by Razor Blade; March 2nd, 2004 at 19:42..

[kiraseed]

Dont alway's believe what you hear. I dont think any company would set guidelines like these.

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[Razor Blade]

Sure Sony may have stricter guidlines than lets say Nintendo, but Sony also has a greater audience to please of all ages. The whole 2D thing just makes me mad though. If this was true I would be majorly pissed if I was a fan of those games. But it seems a little too crude to be true.

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[l3illyl3ob]

http://www.rpgamer.com/games/ys/ys6/screens/ys6041.jpg
http://www.rpgamer.com/games/other/p.../pucelle01.jpg
http://www.rpgamer.com/games/other/p...ombrave137.jpg

All these and more coming soon to a ps2 near you. No 2D games? That's crap. In la pucelle and phantom brave, the battle maps are polygonal, and in Ys the ground/surrounding area are polygonal, but that's it. People, monsters, and in la pucelle and phantom brave, alot of storyline areas are 2D. These games are 2D at heart, and are not made to impress anyone with their graphics by any stretch of the imagination. If Sony is letting these people make these games, they're not as strict as people say they are.

[_E_]

merged both threads now. Personally I dont want to see 2D games dying anytime soon.

Yours,
-Elly

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[Strider]

aye... its been all these years and street fighter is till probably the most popular fighting game series... and its 2d

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[Recca]

Lets just hope that they die for that.

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[Katsuya]

It appears several websites have been taken down after they posted the documents.

Radio Stations all over Asia have been asking people what they think of this.

Nintendo and Sony management haven't commented yet.

However, some game companies have...

-data-
Capcom: It's true that development of 2D games is frowned upon by the big three (Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft) but we don't think it's as bad as everyone is making it out to be.

Konami: If we can't negotiate a way around guidelines we usually just take it to another platform.

Square-Enix: No comment.

Working Designs: We have no comment at this time...

Sammy: We have had some pressure to ad 3D elements before.

Nintendo R&D team member: I've heard the rumors but I don't believe them.
-data-

[Razor Blade]

I'll agree with Nintendo. I think that some console manufacturers would like all games to be beautiful and 3d but 2d is still appealing to many people. Meh.

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[l3illyl3ob]

katsuya, could you please start posting your sources? It helps filter rumors better.

[Katsuya]

Originally Posted by l3illyl3ob

katsuya, could you please start posting your sources? It helps filter rumors better.

For Which one?

(if you look at the top you can see one of my sources)

Meh....

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Last edited by Katsuya; December 10th, 2005 at 04:53..

[Gamer1]

i already knew this from a while ago, that's why the rockman collection never made its way to america.

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[l3illyl3ob]

Originally Posted by Katsuya

For witch one?

(if you look at the top you can see one of my sources)

Meh....

specifically the second one. To me they're just text without much meaning until i know they came from a reliable source.

[Syed Fawad]

So what? I'll play 2D games on me mobile

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[Katsuya]

Originally Posted by l3illyl3ob

specifically the second one. To me they're just text without much meaning until i know they came from a reliable source.

Can you read Japanese?

http://watch.impress.co.jp/game/

[cloudvii]

i think that is a rumor or a stupid act which will be rethought about leading to ask forgivness from 2d games companies .
btw do u know what's SNK's comment ?

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[Player-X]

So far style is second to function,I like 2d games like Onimusha due to it's "you need to predict what the boss is gonna do" gameplay